Two award-winning South African cabaret performers, Aletia Upstairs and Godfrey Johnson, discuss their careers, unique perspectives on cabaret, and experiences on stage for Music Pod with Hanlé Barnard. Hanlé first worked with Aletia Upstairs and Godfrey Johnson in 1996 and has always admired their work. She asked these stars to interview each other.
📷 by WMW Photography
Aletia Upstairs, has established herself as one of South Africa’s leading cabaret stars. She was a QX Cabaret Awards nominee, a Jazz Idols finalist in 2017 with the London Gay Big Band, and received five-star reviews at the Edinburgh Festival Fringe in 2018. Her academic and international achievements include winning a PhD scholarship to Leeds Beckett University in 2015 and working with the International Cabaret Conference at Yale University. She is also the sister of Francois van Coke, lead singer of the iconic South African rock band FOKOFPOLISIEKAR
Spotlight on Aletia Upstairs:
GJ: We met many years ago. Do you remember what we were doing at the time or how we met?
AU: I was Flora Dora Daisy, ‘like the fairy of the dell….’ A Janice Honeyman panto at UCT in 1996. You freed my voice. You made me sing in a sort of Mahalia Jackson way. My part had no singing whatsoever. I was the narrator, so we decided to let me sing all the narration in a classical gospel style. Phenomenal Woman, in the show, is a tribute to this style, written by Sigrun Paschke, specifically to give my voice that kind of scope.
GJ: You will be in Cape Town for a relatively short time. I'm really looking forward to the show we are going to be presenting. I love performing with you. How would you describe your music?
AU: I love performing with you too. It’s really easy. You are really easy-going. I guess we are both pretty easy-going, hence the name of the show – Simpatico as well, but also, we have a lot of shared repertoires, so that makes it so easy. When I was reviving the script, I couldn’t even tell who sang what exactly. We could actually just stand in for each other! The cabaret music I perform is not American Songbook; it is not about singing beautiful songs – it is – as cabaret should be – acting through song. Stylistically, my version is immersive-participatory cabaret. I employ the necessary elements of chiaroscuro in order to take the audience on an emotional roller coaster ride with me.
GJ: What are some of your main theatre influences and why?
AU: Tadeusz Kantor, a Polish theatre director – but more of a visual artist, really, who broke all the rules of theatre, is probably the main one. I studied his work for my PhD. It is postdramatic theatre, which sits nicely with my version of cabaret – non-theatrical lighting, and staging, exposing the sense of illusion.
GJ: Who are your main musical influences?
AU: At the moment, I really love Joni Mitchell. Tom Waits – always, Cohen. I appreciate the work of Meow Meow, Amanda Palmer, Ute Lemper. Opera has actually influenced me a lot. I wanted to be an opera singer once upon a time. I did a collaboration with a Basque soprano a few years ago and it forced me to publicly sing opera for once. I sang the alto and tenor parts with her. Pirate Jenny was in that show in Bilbao.
GJ: What are you currently working on?
AU: I have my new show, Disordered. It will be premiered at the Museum of Comedy in London on July 26th. It is about borderline personality disorder. You know how you work through your own issues in your art, hoping that someone will relate? It’s another one of those. I have two chapters for handbooks out for publication. One is about Performance Activism, and the other about Mike Leigh’s method in relation to Stanislavsky’s. It is great to have Mike Leigh’s direct input in the article about him.
GJ: What are your plans for the next 2 years?
AU: To become financially independent, and country independent – We have to manifest! – and to be successful in my creativity course. After that, the online cabaret course that you (Godfrey) have been telling me to create since 2020. This will be the easier of the two, so I started with the bigger challenge. I am a creativity coach and mentor, and the course is a way to reach a wider audience. I’ve changed my Facebook name for this and everything! Also, to paint and to explore the world more. I have an Artist as Explorer mindset. There are 2 songs from that album in the show.
GJ: Do you think cabaret has relevance in the 21st century?
AU: Absolutely. It’s a shame how far cabaret has become removed from its origins of being a mode of social commentary. In many contexts, cabaret is a stage show with lots of ladies in feathers and sequence and not much else. In the UK, my style is acceptable as it includes humour. Without that, they would probably hate me.
GJ: You have studied so many very and interesting things, what has excited you most?
AU: The idea of performing with my audience is really my thing. I call it playing with my audience. I am completely bored to death by passive performances. I am interested in work where the audience has to play their part in creating the experience – where the art is in the shared experience.
GJ: How do you relax?
AU: I swim in the river downstairs. (I live in a little village in England.) During the colder months, I row in my little boat. I work in my allotment as a form of going to the gym, walking and cycling in the countryside. I paint…but now that is becoming a bit more serious as I’m painting the scenography for my next show. This is a massive challenge, actually.
GJ: When does inspiration strike?
AU: As David Lynch says, we have to catch the big fish. Inspiration is around us all the time and, in our dreams, too. Beyond improving my mental health and my intuition, meditation helps to open me up to creative impulses and ideas.
GJ: What would you call your theatre?
AU: Stylistically, my version of cabaret is immersive-participatory cabaret. I call it playing with my audience.
You can find Aletia Upstairs on Facebook, X (formerly Twitter) and Instagram
📷 by Tim Marshall
Godrey Johnson in Vaslav
Godfrey Johnson is a six-time Fleur du Cap Theatre Awards nominee and one of South Africa’s most innovative cabaret artists, continues to break boundaries. His acclaimed one-man play Vaslav, a tribute to Vaslav Nijinsky, showcased his unparalleled talent. An internationally recognized performer, Johnson has brought the works of Jacques Brel, Noël Coward, and Pieter-Dirk Uys to global audiences. His ability to blend music, satire, and performance art has earned him a dedicated following. In a theatre landscape where cabaret is often underrepresented, Godfrey Johnson’s work fills a critical artistic void.
Spotlight on Godfrey Johnson:
AU: Who inspired you to work as a cabaretist?
GJ: My plan was to become a concert pianist and composer, but I panicked and changed my mind. In 1992. James Blanckenberg, who was a drama lecturer at UCT, invited me to compose music for a student production written by Julie Barker. I had no experience, but the collaboration turned out to be effortless and joyful. It was a political, satirical cabaret, and it marked the start of a new addiction. An addiction to the multi-faceted world of cabaret. The people who have made a huge creative impact on me include Jacques Brel, Kurt Weill, Federico Fellini, Pieter-Dirk Uys, Leonard Cohen, Paolo Conte, Peggy Lee, Béla Bartók, Bertolt Brecht, Mark Twain, Leiber and Stoller, Nina Simone, and current artists like Nina Hagen, Meredith Monk, Grace Jones and Aletia Upstairs. All the composers I've played over the years have had a huge impact on me, I love poetry and art and sometimes the inspiration can simply be the giggle of a child or the memory of a painting.
AU: What should the structure of a cabaret be?
GJ: think a combination of satire, music, originality, and something emotionally colorful yet slightly uncomfortable is key. It should entertain, enlighten, and educate. The cabaretist's role is to expose the rot behind the veneers.
AU: Do you think that it is essential to have a director for a cabaret show?
GJ: Having a good director certainly helps, especially when you're lucky enough to work with talented individuals like Megan Choritz, James Blanckenberg, Jonathan Keevey, Geoffrey Hyland, Sanjin Muftic, and Lara Bye. A director helps create a structure that's not predictable or repetitive.
AU: Do you think cabaret needs to have the juxtaposition of comedy and torch songs?
GJ: I do! There is no specific musical style for cabaret. Benjamin Britten wrote a series of amazing cabaret songs for soprano, sad, hilarious and poetic. As an audience member I would like to be surprised, seduced and horrified.
AU: What makes something cabaret?
GJ: Originality, empathy and biting observation.
AU: Do you think social commentary is an essential element of cabaret?
GJ: I do. That was its original purpose. People confuse revue and cabaret. Lip syncing and glorified karaoke are definitely not cabaret. I think Peggy Lee's "Mirrors" is a great introduction to the world of cabaret.
AU: So, you are a director now. Was this your first time directing (pure) theatre? How was that experience for you? Would you like to do that again?
GJ: I absolutely love it. It is a very musical thing to do as speaking is music and I am especially interested in the spaces between moments and breathing. I am enthralled by the way actors create and develop characters. How do you keep it authentic and exciting night after night?. It was not my very first time, but it was my first time in a long time. I would love to focus on it more as I get older. It is a new play by Pieter de Vos based on some magical moments in the life of Paul Kruger. New writing is a challenge as there is nothing to compare it to but what a satisfying experience. Working with a fantastic writer is a wondrous thing. Deirdre Wolhuter and Fanie Schoeman were brilliant.
AU: What are you currently working on?
GJ: I am compiling all my original work that I have created over the years. I have been working original songs as well as solo piano pieces inspired by some of my favourite poems.
You can find Godfrey Johnson on: Facebook & Instagram
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